How to shoot photos using a binocular Leitz Wetzlar SM-LUX?

jmur · Post by **jmur** » Mon Jul 12, 2010 2:23 pm

I have been following this site for some time now and would like to get a little deeper into the hobby. Like many, available funds are minimal.
I currently have a SM-LUX bino (grey mdl) with 10x eyepieces and the std. four
Lietz objectives. I also own a Canon 450D which I would like to use with a scope. I prefer a non-afocal approach and have an adaptor which lets me couple the camera to the scope minus lens and eyepiece. I've modified an old webcam and used it some but would like something with greater definition, color and detail. I also have a fairly exspensive copy stand on which to mount a camera.
Sorry, my question is can I obtain nice results with minimal additional equip. for what I now have and if so what. Would I be better off saving for a different scope?
I truely appreciate your help and input.

Admin edit: changed title from "Yet another newbie question about equipment"

Craig Gerard · Post by **Craig Gerard** » Mon Jul 12, 2010 5:49 pm

Welcome jmur,

Is your binocular SM-LUX scope similar to the one at the link below:
http://www.xs4all.nl/~marelvan/smll.jpg

Craig

jmur · Post by **jmur** » Mon Jul 12, 2010 8:50 pm

Craig Gerard wrote:Welcome jmur,

Is your binocular SM-LUX scope similar to the one at the link below:
http://www.xs4all.nl/~marelvan/smll.jpg

Craig

Yes. The only difference is my condensor has rack and pinion focusing like used for the stage and of course the field iris is adjustable.

Craig Gerard · Post by **Craig Gerard** » Thu Jul 15, 2010 11:54 pm

I'm bumping this post.

Can anyone familiar with the Leitz Wetzlar SM-LUX offer jmur some advice?

C'mon you Leitz people....I know you are out there

Craig

rjlittlefield · Post by **rjlittlefield** » Fri Jul 16, 2010 9:45 am

At Craig's suggestion, I've moved this topic to the Equipment Discussions forum where it may get more exposure.

--Rik

Craig Gerard · Post by **Craig Gerard** » Fri Jul 16, 2010 5:50 pm

That's better

Now, if we could just get 'Leitz Wetzlar SM-LUX' in the title somewhere

Craig

jmur · Post by **jmur** » Fri Jul 16, 2010 6:22 pm

That's ok guys. I appreciate your help, but it really isn't that big of a deal.
Actually it's becoming a little embarassing at this point.
I probably should take up a hobby that I'm more familiar with. Thanks again.

rjlittlefield · Post by **rjlittlefield** » Fri Jul 16, 2010 7:41 pm

jmur, it's no longer about you, it's about us!

We really should be able to either answer your question or explain why not.

Let me take a crack at talking through this one.

I am not familiar with this particular scope.

However, from what I can see in the picture and glean from the web, you have a microscope body equipped with a removable binocular head and objectives that are designed for 170 mm tube length and require a weak "compensating" eyepiece to cancel a bit of CA (chromatic aberration) that was designed into the objectives to make the whole system work better as a matched combination.

Given those objectives, you really need compensating optics to finish the image formation, so that what ends up on the sensor of your camera does not have significant CA. Switching to a direct projection system, with no optics other than the objectives, would leave you with CA. So would using any other sort of adapter that does not include compensation to match your Leitz objectives. If you can find an adapter such as a projection eyepiece that includes the proper compensation, then you also have to worry about excessive cropping if the adapter is designed for the old 36x24 mm film size instead of your DSLR's smaller sensor.

Going afocal, on the other hand, would utilize the compensation already built into your current eyepieces, and would allow you to match the DSLR's sensor size simply by choosing the correct focal length for the lens on camera.

Given all this, I'm inclined to suggest that you reconsider using the afocal approach. The added hardware is minimal: an appropriate lens and possibly a matching mount adapter to fit on the camera. See for example the discussion HERE and following, and another sample image from that setup HERE.

I will also tweak the thread title here as suggested by Craig. I'm pretty sure that some of our members are familiar with your scope, and perhaps some of them will have better ideas than I do.

Can you tell us more about what sorts of subjects you want to photograph, and what magnifications you want to look at? There are other schemes that overlap the magnification range of your scope, some of them retaining use of the scope's stage and condenser, but swapping out some of the optics. The more we know, the better advice we can offer.

--Rik

Craig Gerard · Post by **Craig Gerard** » Fri Jul 16, 2010 7:42 pm

jmur,

Your initial question led me on a search through the forum archives. During that search I read many articles that I would not have otherwise read. It was a worthwhile exercise.

The item I indicated, may provide a means by which to achieve your desired outcome; but I would need confirmation from Leitz users among our membership.

The information I received regarding the Leitz Wetzlar Red Dot Periplan Ocular with PhotoTube is as follows:
http://www.xs4all.nl/~marelvan/redd.jpg

Yes... the tube diameter is the same as the standard binohead of a SM-LUX and other bino's ... some are 30 mm. Even than you can use a converter from 30 - 23.2 mm. Just check if the inside diameter is 23.2 mm.

I hope this has been of some help.

*It appears this post was uploaded at the same time as Rik's response.

Craig

jmur · Post by **jmur** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:31 am

Thanks again. The links you provided are extremely helpful. I'll reconsider my approach and see what happens. I am interested mainly in fresh water pond life, esp. algaes. I'm not seeking extreme magnification
but am interested in good definition and color.

Charles Krebs · Post by **Charles Krebs** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 9:25 am

jmur,

I prefer a non-afocal approach and have an adaptor which lets me couple the camera to the scope minus lens and eyepiece.

To add to what Rik has said. In addition to the eyepiece chromatic correction (which may or may not be a "deal-killer) one of the biggest difficulties setting up direct-projection is getting the camera body to a location where the image is in focus on the sensor without needing to change the microscope focus from it's normal "viewing" focus. This is because the typical DSLR has a body depth of about 44-46mm, and the intermediate image (the one formed by the objective that you want to place onto the sensor) occurs typically about 10mm down from the edge of the eyepiece tubes). You could try direct-projection with the 4X and 10X by positioning the camera body as close as possible over an empty eyepiece tube. The would require significant microscope re-focus, but the 4X and 10X can usually handle it OK. An objective with higher powers may not work as well used this way.

Afocal can work great. A tricky part is finding a camera lens of the right focal length (about 40-50mm) that permits you to match up the lens entrance pupil with the eyepiece so that there is little or no vignetting (dark corners). Most lenses (and especially zooms) can't be positioned close enough.

Pau · Post by **Pau** » Sat Jul 17, 2010 12:37 pm

jmur,
As others said, Leitz objectives need a corrective eyepiece (Periplan type). Even the original Leiz photoadapters are based in the afocal method, some lenses over a Periplan eyepiece to focus its virtual image in the film plane. Leitz never made (I'm pretty sure) photo eyepieces for "direct projection" as Olympus and Nikon done.

The correction of the Olympus NFK photo eyepieces is close to the Periplans, but they are expensive and difficult to properly set up in a binocular head.

Direct projection is not a good idea. I tested some of my high end Leitz objectives this way and the image is excellent in the centre but degrades quickly and heavily to the borders (both in sharpness and C.A.)

If your periplan eyepieces have the eyeglasses symbol, it may be easy to set up an afocal solution. If you haven't an standard 50mm Canon lens, you can buy on eBay for little money an Olympus OM Zuiko 50mm f1.8 and an adapter to Canon (or another brand: Nikon, Pentax or Zeiss M42...). I tested this solution with very good results. A 40mm lens would be preferable, but more difficult to find.

The red dot periplans are recommended for photo, but I didn't find any difference compared with similar eyepieces without the dot.

jmur · Post by **jmur** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 4:15 am

Charles & Pau: Thanks very much for the additional info. With all that has
been offered, it has given me the info needed to decide how to proceed in
a reasonable manner to attempt to achieve my goals. Thanks again for your time and kind help.