Mitutoyo objective clones

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terante1981
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Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by terante1981 »

I see a lot of companies cloning the Mitutoyo objective like these (https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002 ... 3e5fZvjNZy) :shock:

Is this because the lens design is easily to replicate and the design is known. I would like to build my own objective with off the shelf parts that is similar to performance with Mitutoyo. Referencing this design would give be awesome start. Any references to the standard Mitutoyo M Plan Apo series would be appreciated !

Thanks

Chris S.
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Re: Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by Chris S. »

terante1981, welcome to posting! :D

I doubt it's at all easy to build a Mitutoyo clone. I've in the past tested some such lenses from one company, and they were horrible. On the other hand, I've recently been testing a lens from the company in your link, and will soon be posting on its superb results. The difference between "horrible" and "superb," I think, is the substantial insight and work from the maker of the superb lens.

But if you do succeed in building Mitutoyo-quality lenses from off-the-shelf parts, I'll read your report, here, with delight!

Cheers,

--Chris S.

Lou Jost
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Re: Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by Lou Jost »

I don't want to discourage you, and meybe you have far more tools and resources than I imagine, but building a good one from scratch sounds impossible. It doesn't even seem possible to put a real one back together after taking it apart. Collimation and spacing is very difficult.

RobertOToole
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Re: Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by RobertOToole »

Chris S. wrote:
Thu May 05, 2022 10:48 pm

........will soon be posting on its superb results.....
That's not fair Chris, not even a sneak peek?

Best,

Robert

Chris S.
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Re: Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by Chris S. »

RobertOToole wrote:
Fri May 06, 2022 2:19 pm
That's not fair Chris, not even a sneak peek?
PM'd. :D

Scarodactyl
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Re: Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by Scarodactyl »

The big question is which magnification it might be (could it be the 50x/0.65???)

Chris S.
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Re: Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by Chris S. »

Scarodactyl wrote:
Fri May 06, 2022 2:48 pm
The big question is which magnification it might be (could it be the 50x/0.65???)
Not that one, yet.

Scarodactyl
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Re: Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by Scarodactyl »

Alrighty, I'll go off high alert since I already have the other mags covered, but this should be great news for the community.

Chris S.
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Re: Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by Chris S. »

Scarodactyl wrote:
Fri May 06, 2022 4:29 pm
Alrighty, I'll go off high alert since I already have the other mags covered, but this should be great news for the community.
I didn't mean to cause a splash in terante1981's thread (sorry!)

The lens I tested seems a bit better than my Mitutoyo of same magnification and NA (which has been tested against numerous others, so is a "known good"). The test lens costs much less, however, and is of a magnification that is hard to find on the used market. On this basis, (since a good Mitutoyo is great, but expensive) I feel comfortable in having called the test lens "superb" in this thread. I'll post on it soon, and would urge potential buyers to wait for that post--I do have other thoughts I'd like to mention.

--Chris S.

dolmadis
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Re: Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by dolmadis »

(https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002 ... 3e5fZvjNZy)

Is there another link where these are being sold because the link gives me "no stock"?

Best, John

terante1981
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Re: Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by terante1981 »

dolmadis wrote:
Sat May 07, 2022 12:56 am
(https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002 ... 3e5fZvjNZy)

Is there another link where these are being sold because the link gives me "no stock"?

Best, John
Other clones of Mitutoyo I have found so far:
  • Motic 10X ELWD ICO 0.28 NA, 33.5 mm WD
I really think that the design of the Mitutoyo objective must be available somewhere, else there wouldn't be so many copies of it. It is an exceptionally good objective.

Cheers!

Scarodactyl
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Re: Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by Scarodactyl »

Not all of these are properly 'clones' of the Mitutoyo objectives, at least in the sense of being direct faithful copies. They are lookalikes with similar (though not always identical) nominal specs and highly variable performance. On the ones I have tried it is easy to see differences in assembly and things like lens diameters. A couple I have tried have been good (on aps-c) and a couple have not.
Last edited by Scarodactyl on Sat May 07, 2022 3:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

dolmadis
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Re: Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by dolmadis »

I may have misunderstood but I gathered from the post from Chris S that he has been testing an objective (s) from the seller on this link?

(https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002 ... 3e5fZvjNZy)

I know that Chris S urged purchasers to wait for further comments but stock does seem to have dried up if you go that link.

Best, John

rjlittlefield
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Re: Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by rjlittlefield »

I would like to build my own objective with off the shelf parts that is similar to performance with Mitutoyo.
I admire your ambition!

But to put some issues in perspective...

Inside a Mitutoyo objective there are roughly a half-dozen lens elements. Each of those has a different front curvature, rear curvature, thickness, and separation from its neighbor, and is made of glass with a specific refractive index and dispersion, which vary from one lens element to another. This makes a total of roughly 35 different parameters, which during the design process were co-optimized as an ensemble so as to give the best overall performance. There is roughly speaking zero chance that you would find any one of those components available as an off-the-shelf part, let alone that you would find an entire set of compatible parts, and at a favorable price, and then be able to assemble them to the accuracy needed to achieve the potential performance of the design.

terante1981 wrote:I really think that the design of the Mitutoyo objective must be available somewhere, else there wouldn't be so many copies of it.
Scarodactyl wrote:Not all of these are properly 'clones' of the mititoyo objectives, at least in the sense of being direct faithful copies. They are lookalikes with similar (though not always identical) nominal specs and highly variable performance.
Reinforcing this point, I note that the published parameters for four out of the five "Other clones of Mitutoyo I have found so far" are not quite the same as Mitutoyo M Plan Apos.

The set from gaoptics.com does seem to have specifications that are identical to Mitutoyo, except possibly for the 5X whose specifications are absent from their site, and in any case their prices are similar to Mitutoyo's also. (The 10X is actually a little more expensive: $915.56 from GA versus $900 for Mitutoyo from Edmund Optics.)

--Rik

RobertOToole
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Re: Mitutoyo objective clones

Post by RobertOToole »

Scarodactyl wrote:
Sat May 07, 2022 8:22 am
Not all of these are properly 'clones' of the Mitutoyo objectives, at least in the sense of being direct faithful copies. They are lookalikes with similar (though not always identical) nominal specs and highly variable performance. On the ones I have tried it is easy to see differences in assembly and things like lens diameters. A couple I have tried have been good (on aps-c) and a couple have not.
An import factor that you won't be able to see on inspection is condition over time.

I've returned every used Mitutoyo 20x M Plan I've bought on the used market due to inner element condition, looks like some kind of damage, delamination, or cement failure. Some of these were never used, new in-the-box, but still had issues.

Will the clones have the same issues I wonder?

Best,

Robert

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