I need help...
I have a MP-E 65, it's possible mount on my Canon 30D a bellows and the mp-e?
With mp-e the max magnification is 5X, wath is with the bellows and mp-e?
Or is better mount on the bellows a different lens?
Thanks in advance
Roberto
MP-e 65 and bellows
Moderators: rjlittlefield, ChrisR, Chris S., Pau
-
Charles Krebs
- Posts: 5865
- Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2006 8:02 pm
- Location: Issaquah, WA USA
- Contact:
Roberto,
I've never tried it but it would certainly give you higher magnifications. But there are significant problems with this approach. Most obviously you no longer have aperture control (unless you rig up something like the expensive Novoflex solution). But even if that were not a problem, you would have a very difficult time with working distance. The 65MP-E has a front that is sized to accept 58mm filters. At it's maximum magnification many users find the working distance a little tough to deal with because of the large size of the front of the lens. Extending it more would reduce working distance even more. I don't think this is very practical.
If you want to go to a higher magnification than the MP-E provides, there are some options. If you have a good 1.4 or 2X converter you can give that a try. (I can't remember right now but you might need a small extension tube between the Canon 1.4X and the MP-E to allow the optics to "fit").
If you do have a bellows that you can mount your 30D onto, then you can look for a better lens to use on the bellows. In order to make it worthwhile (that is, to provide magnifications considerably more than the 65 MP-E) you would need a lens with a focal length of about 25mm or less. Your working distance will be very small, but the diameter of the front these lenses can be very small so even though you are close to the subject it is not too hard to get light onto your subject. Olympus and Canon both made small (RMS screw thread) 20mm lenses to be used on bellows. These would be excellent choices. A 10X microscope objective usually has a focal length of about 16mm - 20mm, and the right one can work very well.
Charlie
I've never tried it but it would certainly give you higher magnifications. But there are significant problems with this approach. Most obviously you no longer have aperture control (unless you rig up something like the expensive Novoflex solution). But even if that were not a problem, you would have a very difficult time with working distance. The 65MP-E has a front that is sized to accept 58mm filters. At it's maximum magnification many users find the working distance a little tough to deal with because of the large size of the front of the lens. Extending it more would reduce working distance even more. I don't think this is very practical.
If you want to go to a higher magnification than the MP-E provides, there are some options. If you have a good 1.4 or 2X converter you can give that a try. (I can't remember right now but you might need a small extension tube between the Canon 1.4X and the MP-E to allow the optics to "fit").
If you do have a bellows that you can mount your 30D onto, then you can look for a better lens to use on the bellows. In order to make it worthwhile (that is, to provide magnifications considerably more than the 65 MP-E) you would need a lens with a focal length of about 25mm or less. Your working distance will be very small, but the diameter of the front these lenses can be very small so even though you are close to the subject it is not too hard to get light onto your subject. Olympus and Canon both made small (RMS screw thread) 20mm lenses to be used on bellows. These would be excellent choices. A 10X microscope objective usually has a focal length of about 16mm - 20mm, and the right one can work very well.
Charlie
Thanks for your answer.
I make this question because don't have great experience with macro.
I understand this:
Bellows joined with MP-E isn't a good solution because to much little work distance.
Bellows and short lens is a good choice (wich magnification?)
1,4 X or 2 X converter and MP-E is a good choice (wich magnification?)
Excuse me for a lot of questions...
My first idea was to buy a microscope, but I don't have money for buy a good microscope and I think is a good idea use my MP-E for obtained more magnification.
That I want is obtain a photo of insect... look like yours... (obviously not at the same quality...).
Maybe a stereomicroscope do better photo than MP-E only or MP-E with 2 X converter or bellows and a short lens.
I hope you understand my poor english language..
Thanks in advance
Roberto.
I make this question because don't have great experience with macro.
I understand this:
Bellows joined with MP-E isn't a good solution because to much little work distance.
Bellows and short lens is a good choice (wich magnification?)
1,4 X or 2 X converter and MP-E is a good choice (wich magnification?)
Excuse me for a lot of questions...
My first idea was to buy a microscope, but I don't have money for buy a good microscope and I think is a good idea use my MP-E for obtained more magnification.
That I want is obtain a photo of insect... look like yours... (obviously not at the same quality...).
Maybe a stereomicroscope do better photo than MP-E only or MP-E with 2 X converter or bellows and a short lens.
I hope you understand my poor english language..
Thanks in advance
Roberto.
-
Charles Krebs
- Posts: 5865
- Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2006 8:02 pm
- Location: Issaquah, WA USA
- Contact:
Roberto,
Yes you have stated it correctly.
I would not go out and purchase a 1.4X or 2X just for use with the 65 MP-E, but if you already have one it is worth trying. (Just check carefully that it will fit properly... some converters have real elements that stick out too far, and you may need to place a short extension tube between the two). A 1.4X converter would get you to 7X with the 65mm MP-E, and a 2X converter would get you to 10X. With the converters the minimum working distance remains the same as when the lens is used by itself.
A short focal length lens on a bellows (25mm or less) will give you greater magnifications than the 65mm MP-E. But the aperture must be set manually, and bellows are best used indoors in controlled settings. They can be difficult to work with outside. The magnifications you get will depend on the length of the bellows and the focal length of the lens. A 20mm bellows lens on an "average" length bellows should get you up to somewhere between 8X to 10X.
Do you already have either a bellows or converters?
Charlie
Yes you have stated it correctly.
I would not go out and purchase a 1.4X or 2X just for use with the 65 MP-E, but if you already have one it is worth trying. (Just check carefully that it will fit properly... some converters have real elements that stick out too far, and you may need to place a short extension tube between the two). A 1.4X converter would get you to 7X with the 65mm MP-E, and a 2X converter would get you to 10X. With the converters the minimum working distance remains the same as when the lens is used by itself.
A short focal length lens on a bellows (25mm or less) will give you greater magnifications than the 65mm MP-E. But the aperture must be set manually, and bellows are best used indoors in controlled settings. They can be difficult to work with outside. The magnifications you get will depend on the length of the bellows and the focal length of the lens. A 20mm bellows lens on an "average" length bellows should get you up to somewhere between 8X to 10X.
Do you already have either a bellows or converters?
Charlie
Thanks Charlie,
yesterday I buy a set of 3 extension tube and a 2X teleconverter.
Next days I try to shot something...
I buy too a Proxxon table and I must fix on a solid support, and after I can try to "stacking"... (maybe)
I think can't use only MT-24 EX... what do I use for more light?
I see in some macro setup, two flexible light (maybe optical fiber?)...
Roberto.
yesterday I buy a set of 3 extension tube and a 2X teleconverter.
Next days I try to shot something...
I buy too a Proxxon table and I must fix on a solid support, and after I can try to "stacking"... (maybe)
I think can't use only MT-24 EX... what do I use for more light?
I see in some macro setup, two flexible light (maybe optical fiber?)...
Roberto.
-
rjlittlefield
- Site Admin
- Posts: 23608
- Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2006 8:34 am
- Location: Richland, Washington State, USA
- Contact:
Yes, from a 150 watt (maximum) halogen illuminator.RobertoM wrote:I see in some macro setup, two flexible light (maybe optical fiber?)
With this type of lighting, vibration is more problem than with flash.
If I set the illuminator on full intensity, exposure times might be around 1/10 second. That's not good because it is about how long shutter vibration lasts.
I usually turn the intensity down so that exposure time is more like 1 or 2 seconds. That is better because it gives time for shutter vibration to die down, so most of the exposure is steady.
--Rik