How to mount square tube vertically?

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naturepics43
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Post by naturepics43 »


Deanimator
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Post by Deanimator »

Thanks.

That's very helpful.

Deanimator
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Post by Deanimator »

naturepics43 wrote:What about these? http://www.menards.com/main/tools-hardw ... 52&ipos=34
I don't know. It's possible.

I don't think we have Menard's here, but I'm pretty sure that Lowe's and Home Depot have something similar.

The issues are:
  1. Are they stiff enough?
  2. Do they come up far enough to allow enough purchase for bolts?
  3. Do the dimensions allow for them to be properly positioned?
I'd need to look at them next Sunday or Monday when I'm off (and awake).

Thanks for the suggestion.

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Post by Deanimator »

GrayPlayer wrote:One option for mounting square tube vertically, 4 90 degree angle irons, off setting bolts.
Definitely a possibility. That could be very stable, depending upon the execution.

I've asked an ex-engineer friend who works at Home Depot how to do it. He'll either come up with a quick, cheap and easy solution... or one that's more expensive than five Wemacro rails, won't fit on my work surface and doesn't do what I want. Flip a coin. :wink:

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Post by Saul »

Deanimator wrote:
Thanks.

That's very helpful.
NP. If you are really thinking about 8020 extrusion type column, I can send you for free (shipping only) , I have some leftovers (little bit shorter than in my setup). I wouldn't go with your column, it will be problem to adapt other parts. 8020 is much more flexible thing. Depending on your setup idea I can add some small pieces. Maybe even I have same corners like in my design, but I have to dig in the garage ...
Saul
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Post by Deanimator »

Saul wrote:
Deanimator wrote:
Thanks.

That's very helpful.
NP. If you are really thinking about 8020 extrusion type column, I can send you for free (shipping only) , I have some leftovers (little bit shorter than in my setup). I wouldn't go with your column, it will be problem to adapt other parts. 8020 is much more flexible thing. Depending on your setup idea I can add some small pieces. Maybe even I have same corners like in my design, but I have to dig in the garage ...
That's very kind of you. A couple of questions:
  1. How would you mount to my work surface (wooden cutting board), their corner pieces?
  2. How would you mount a Wemacro on it?
Again, thanks.

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Post by Saul »

Deanimator wrote:
  1. How would you mount to my work surface (wooden cutting board), their corner pieces?
  2. How would you mount a Wemacro on it?
1.Same like in my setup:

Image

You can attach column directly to the board, without using horizontal piece. I would go for granite base, it is more stable, better vibration dampening.

2.You have mounting holes already:

Image

If you are going to move rail up & down frequently, I would suggest (cheapest/quickest option) aluminum plate (with wing-type 5/16) screws, like:

Image

If you prefer nice version (very comfortable, very low profile), you can use:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B006YVZ4XC/?c ... _lig_dp_it
Saul
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mawyatt
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Post by mawyatt »

enricosavazzi wrote:
mawyatt wrote:WeMacro has a vertical stand created for stacking, for $109 it's hard to beat and even includes a coarse XY stage.

http://www.wemacro.com/?product=vertical-stand

Best,
The WeMacro stand is a good one for starters, and it is made mostly from standard 20/20 parts (except the base).

An advantage of this stand is that it is ready to use, no drilling or machining required (unless you need a different mounting height of the focus rack not supported by pre-drilled holes). A disadvantage is that you cannot choose a longer or thicker column or larger base from the start, and if you are going to swap out parts later it is overall much cheaper to just build the stand with standard 20/20 stock.
ES,

Incorrect, nothing on the Vertical Stand has small 20/20 stock, including the mounting brackets & bolts!! Been busy and just got a chance to measure :D

It has a much more stable verticle bar of 40mm X 40mm, and is the Rigid Extruded 40x40 version, not the standard, nor thin aluminum extrusions. It comes with M8 Allen Head bolts with very rigid extruded right angle braces (3) for mounting the 40mm by 40mm vertical bar to the bottom plate.

So nothing on this is simple small 20/20 stock based. I doubt if one could assemble an equivalent for much less than $109, not to mention the hassle of all cutting, drilling and black anodizing.

Best,
Image
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Post by Deanimator »

I've pretty much settled upon extruded post as the medium for my ultimate rig.

My goals are:
  1. stable
  2. readily adaptable between horizontal and vertical configurations
  3. affordable
For the vertical element, I'm looking at 40x40 extrusion.

I'm still trying to determine what the horizontal element should be.

This seems like what I'm aiming at:

Image

I really need for this to be a single appliance, as I barely have room for what I've got in my living room now.

Any suggestions are welcome.

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Post by Saul »

Saul
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mawyatt
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Post by mawyatt »

The WeMacro Vertical Stand can be used as a good horizontal setup which utilizes the base and 40mm square vertical bar, as well as the designed Vertical Stand setup.

Here's some images and details of the stand.

The 1st image shows the Vertical Stand with a Nikon PB6 Bellows and Canon 35mm Macro lens on a Nikon D800E. The focus rail is a modified THK KR20 surplus rail. I included a couple arms using M8 to 1/4-20 adapters.

Next is the horizontal setup. The vertical bar is rotated to horizontal and held securely on one end (where camera/lens attach) by 2 of the standard right angle clamps bolted to the base in the standard location. The bar other end (subject end) is held by a single M8 to 1/4-20 adapter and T nut. A single 1/4-20 3/4” long bolt with washer comes thru the base center middle hole (3 in a row) and attaches to the M8 adapter. This produces an almost prefect very secure fit with the proper spacing!!! You can see this in the last image especially, note the adapter under the bar.

If you want to mount the XY positioner that comes with the Vertical Stand, then use another M8 adapter and T nut and mount a short ARCA clamp to the base of the positioner, then a short ARCA rail to the M8 adapter as shown in the last couple images. You can also add a couple M8 adapters & T nut to allow mounting arms to the bar for speedlights or whatnot.


Now you have a Vertical Stand that can also work as a compact, sturdy Horizontal Stand, has 4 vibration isolating rubber feet, has a 40mm square sliding rail base for holding the camera/lens and subject on the same 40mm rail (common mode vibration rejection) and has the ability to support sliding arms (by using T nut adapters) for use with speedlights or whatever. Camera/lens and subject holder can slide along the 40mm bar for coarse positioning with the ARCA clamps and M8 Adapters.

Image
Vertical Stand
Image
Horizontal Stand
Image
XY Positioner & Subject End
Image
Subject End

Best,
Research is like a treasure hunt, you don't know where to look or what you'll find!
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Post by Deanimator »

mawyatt wrote:The WeMacro Vertical Stand can be used as a good horizontal setup which utilizes the base and 40mm square vertical bar, as well as the designed Vertical Stand setup.
While the Wemacro mount undoubtedly seems like a high quality piece of equipment, as discussed elsewhere it probably doesn't have enough working distance for some of the lower magnification work I'd like to do.

Do you know if you could switch out the existing 40/40 column for a longer from from 80/20, Inc.?

If so, then yes, it might be a very attractive proposition. If not, multiple rigs are impractical for me due to space limitations. This all takes place in my living room. I have no place else to do it, and I'm getting crowded out by all of my tools, the photography table and a couple of work tables as it is.

mawyatt
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Post by mawyatt »

Deanimator wrote:
mawyatt wrote:The WeMacro Vertical Stand can be used as a good horizontal setup which utilizes the base and 40mm square vertical bar, as well as the designed Vertical Stand setup.
While the Wemacro mount undoubtedly seems like a high quality piece of equipment, as discussed elsewhere it probably doesn't have enough working distance for some of the lower magnification work I'd like to do.

Do you know if you could switch out the existing 40/40 column for a longer from from 80/20, Inc.?

If so, then yes, it might be a very attractive proposition. If not, multiple rigs are impractical for me due to space limitations. This all takes place in my living room. I have no place else to do it, and I'm getting crowded out by all of my tools, the photography table and a couple of work tables as it is.
Well as you can see from the images I have enough working distance for my Printing Nikkor 105mm F2.8A (143mm @ 1X), Canon 35mm F2.8 Bellows Macro, and Mitty's with enough space to include a Precision XY and Rotary Positioner & Ball Head :shock:

My only horizontal stage until now is based upon a Thor Lab Bench & 4 foot rail which allows the camera/lens/focus rail to slide for coarse positioning and also allows the subject stage (Precision XYZ stage & Ball Head) to slide on the same rail (Common Mode Vibration Reduction). It has plenty of room to allow for just about any practical setup I can imagine, but is bulky and was expensive to build many years ago.

This adaptation of the WeMacro Vertical Stage is perfect for a simpler, less bulky horizontal stage, that I plan on using a lot in the future....and it doesn't cost much at all & you get a compact Vertical and Horizontal setup from the same basic components without any machining :D

Best,

Image
Using modified THK-KR20 Focus Rail
Image
With Nikon Printing Nikkor PN105mm F2.8A
Image
With WeMacro Focus Rail & PN105mm F2.8A
Image
With WeMacro Focus Rail
Image
With Mitutoyo & Sigma LSA & THK-KR20 Focus Rail with Precision XYR Stage
Research is like a treasure hunt, you don't know where to look or what you'll find!
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Post by Deanimator »

mawyatt wrote:Well as you can see from the images I have enough working distance for my Printing Nikkor 105mm F2.8A (143mm @ 1X), Canon 35mm F2.8 Bellows Macro, and Mitty's with enough space to include a Precision XY and Rotary Positioner & Ball Head :shock:
Do you think there's enough working distance when vertical to get an entire U.S. Quarter in frame using a Tokina 100mm macro lens?

And do you think that an 80/20 Inc. 40x40 column could be switched for the existing one?

mawyatt
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Post by mawyatt »

Deanimator wrote:
mawyatt wrote:Well as you can see from the images I have enough working distance for my Printing Nikkor 105mm F2.8A (143mm @ 1X), Canon 35mm F2.8 Bellows Macro, and Mitty's with enough space to include a Precision XY and Rotary Positioner & Ball Head :shock:
Do you think there's enough working distance when vertical to get an entire U.S. Quarter in frame using a Tokina 100mm macro lens?

And do you think that an 80/20 Inc. 40x40 column could be switched for the existing one?
The Nikon 105mm Macro VR has a 153mm working distance at 1X and is ~115mm long from the F mount flange, so a total of ~268mm from the camera flange to the subject. The PN105mm F2.8 is ~225mm long, and has a 143mm working distance at 1X, so 368mm total. If the Tokina is similar to the Nikon Macro VR it should have enough room. Since you have the Tokina you should be able to answer this yourself with this info and the images shown.

80/20 won't work you need the 40mm square that has the T mount slot in the center like previously shown. This is a very rigid thick extrusion, much heavier than usual extrusions.
Research is like a treasure hunt, you don't know where to look or what you'll find!
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