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Symptoms of Movement?
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Deanimator



Joined: 23 Oct 2012
Posts: 367
Location: Rocky River, Ohio, U.S.A.

PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 12:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found a very useful website for those interested in cleaning their cameras:

http://www.cleaningdigitalcameras.com/inspecting-for-dust/

I learned how to actually see the dust in the test image (Ctrl-Shift-L in Photoshop/Elements), which yielded this:



As you can see that's filthy.
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Deanimator



Joined: 23 Oct 2012
Posts: 367
Location: Rocky River, Ohio, U.S.A.

PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, not perfect, but a vast improvement.

There were three or four specks that I just couldn't get off, and I don't have a loupe.

I'll keep playing with wet cleaning, hoping to get the worst three of them.

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Deanimator



Joined: 23 Oct 2012
Posts: 367
Location: Rocky River, Ohio, U.S.A.

PostPosted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The hits just keep coming!

I spent the better part of this afternoon and evening trying to clean the sensor.. I just seem to be moving the dirt around.

Amazon says that USPS tried to deliver my good swabs and cleaning fluid 4-5 days early to my friend's [maybe] closed office. With the post office, who knows.

On the plus side, while one of my flashes died, Amazon Prime is replacing it, no questions asked.

I also ordered a loupe yesterday, since when I look at the sensor, I saw NOTHING.

Oh well, if you want to learn a LOT about photography, FAST, take up macrophotography...
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Deanimator



Joined: 23 Oct 2012
Posts: 367
Location: Rocky River, Ohio, U.S.A.

PostPosted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For a minute I thought I'd damaged the sensor, but it was just a bad image in the stack.

There are still a few artifacts, but it looks a lot better. We'll see how my good cleaning stuff works.

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Chris S.
Site Admin


Joined: 05 Apr 2009
Posts: 2848
Location: Ohio, USA

PostPosted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Definitely an improvement. Very Happy

Deanimator wrote:
I spent the better part of this afternoon and evening trying to clean the sensor.. I just seem to be moving the dirt around.

I suspect you're running up against an under-discussed element of sensor cleaning: Cleaning fluid lifts gunk off the sensor into solution; to remove this dissolved gunk, you need to wick the fluid, before it dries, into the swab and then pull the swab away; if the cleaning solvent evaporates from the sensor, it simply drops the dissolved gunk back onto the sensor. Bearing this in mind, one must consider how the swab works: When not compressed (squished against the sensor), the swab can hold a certain amount of liquid solvent; when squished against the sensor, the swab's ability to hold solvent decreases, so solvent oozes out onto the sensor where it does its work; by pulling the swab across the sensor while applying squishing pressure, the liquid solvent is squeegee'd across the sensor; at the far end of the stroke, it's important to decrease pressure on the swab for a brief instant before pulling it away--this decrease in compression makes the swab "thirsty" again, sucking the solvent up into it and away from the sensor.

Whenever one finds oneself chasing gunk around the sensor, the culprit is usually that the cleaning solvent is evaporating, rather than being mechanically removed while still in liquid form.

I often clean sensors with 91 percent isopropanol. While this evaporates a bit too quickly in most cases, I can add water as needed to obtain an evaporation rate convenient to the conditions at hand. A too-fast evaporating solvent is difficult to clean with.

--Chris S.
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Deanimator



Joined: 23 Oct 2012
Posts: 367
Location: Rocky River, Ohio, U.S.A.

PostPosted: Mon Oct 09, 2017 7:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chris S. wrote:
Definitely an improvement. Very Happy

Deanimator wrote:
I spent the better part of this afternoon and evening trying to clean the sensor.. I just seem to be moving the dirt around.

I suspect you're running up against an under-discussed element of sensor cleaning: Cleaning fluid lifts gunk off the sensor into solution; to remove this dissolved gunk, you need to wick the fluid, before it dries, into the swab and then pull the swab away; if the cleaning solvent evaporates from the sensor, it simply drops the dissolved gunk back onto the sensor. Bearing this in mind, one must consider how the swab works: When not compressed (squished against the sensor), the swab can hold a certain amount of liquid solvent; when squished against the sensor, the swab's ability to hold solvent decreases, so solvent oozes out onto the sensor where it does its work; by pulling the swab across the sensor while applying squishing pressure, the liquid solvent is squeegee'd across the sensor; at the far end of the stroke, it's important to decrease pressure on the swab for a brief instant before pulling it away--this decrease in compression makes the swab "thirsty" again, sucking the solvent up into it and away from the sensor.

Whenever one finds oneself chasing gunk around the sensor, the culprit is usually that the cleaning solvent is evaporating, rather than being mechanically removed while still in liquid form.

I often clean sensors with 91 percent isopropanol. While this evaporates a bit too quickly in most cases, I can add water as needed to obtain an evaporation rate convenient to the conditions at hand. A too-fast evaporating solvent is difficult to clean with.

--Chris S.

Thanks for the tip.

While I THINK I was doing that, I wasn't specifically trying to, since as you note, I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere else.

I think another problem is that locally, I could only find a cleaning kit that I don't think I've seen reviewed. Unfortunately, if I wanted to do anything this weekend, it was that or nothing.

As I mentioned above, the GOOD stuff (recommended by Angry Photographer on YouTube) was shipped MUCH earlier than anticipated, and ALLEGEDLY delivery was attempted. I say allegedly, because within the last month and a half, I've had the Postal Service LIE about making or trying to make two deliveries. Maybe they tried to deliver it Saturday, maybe they didn't. Hopefully the stuff will be at my friend's office tomorrow.

That having been said, even with the cheap stuff, there's been a drastic improvement. This pencil was shot using my Tokina 100mm macro and only one flash (I'll be packing the dead one up today). It was somewhat over-exposed since the single flash angle was awkward and partially defeated the diffuser, but it's not bad. The left side is intentionally left out of focus as it was getting late, and I wanted to get a result to see the effect of the last cleaning. As it was, it was 200 exposures and I didn't finish the processing until this morning.

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Deanimator



Joined: 23 Oct 2012
Posts: 367
Location: Rocky River, Ohio, U.S.A.

PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 2:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is the #2 pencil, properly lit this time.

Canon T4i
Minolta 50mm MD manual lens reversed onto two sets of extension tubes
1/200 (I kept catching the shutter at 1/250)
ISO 100
list from the side and above through a small card stock diffuser with two Amazon Basics manual flashes on 1/32.
Wemacro
Stack of 168 processed with Zerene.

Minor exposure and lighting adjustments to the raw files with Elements 15.

All in all, I'm pretty happy with this one. There may be some sensor dust, but I can't see it. I got my good cleaning gear today, as well as my third flash, triggers and magic arm.

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Deanimator



Joined: 23 Oct 2012
Posts: 367
Location: Rocky River, Ohio, U.S.A.

PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I got my good cleaning gear the day before yesterday, including a lighted loupe.

Using the loupe, I was instantly able to see the remaining dust on the sensor. I was able to clean the sensor properly. Here's the result:

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NikonUser



Joined: 04 Sep 2008
Posts: 2530
Location: southern New Brunswick, Canada

PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now that it is clean you may want to consider placing a neutral glass filter on the camera body. I have been using such a system for years, never get any dust on the sensor; lots of oil spots from defective Nikon D600 but no dust!
_________________
NU.
student of entomology
Quote – Holmes on ‘Entomology’
” I suppose you are an entomologist ? “
” Not quite so ambitious as that, sir. I should like to put my eyes on the individual entitled to that name.
No man can be truly called an entomologist,
sir; the subject is too vast for any single human intelligence to grasp.”
Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr
The Poet at the Breakfast Table.

Nikon camera, lenses and objectives
Olympus microscope and objectives
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Deanimator



Joined: 23 Oct 2012
Posts: 367
Location: Rocky River, Ohio, U.S.A.

PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 12:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NikonUser wrote:
Now that it is clean you may want to consider placing a neutral glass filter on the camera body. I have been using such a system for years, never get any dust on the sensor; lots of oil spots from defective Nikon D600 but no dust!

I've never seen one.

What exactly do you order?
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