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Effect of atmospheric pressure on optics
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Smokedaddy



Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 800
Location: Phoenix, Arizona

PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

... so is anyone actually doing that here, meaning UV photography with a lens like you're referring to?
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Lou Jost



Joined: 04 Sep 2015
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Location: Ecuador

PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm gearing up for it. Initially I am focusing on the last generation of chipmaking lenses that used visible light. I now have a decent assortment of 5x and 10x lenses for 436nm (royal blue, mercury g line) and a few old soviet lenses for green light, and a 5x lens for 248nm UV light. Not sure if my astro camera will be sensitive to that UV light. By using that wavelength, diffraction would be reduced by a factor of two. But of course this is only monochrome photography.

I don't think it is worth going farther than 248nm in a home DIY set-up. It may not even be worth it to work with UV at all. We'll see.
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Smokedaddy



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PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was just curious since I have 3 super old monochrome astro cameras.
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Lou Jost



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PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You should experiment!
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Smokedaddy



Joined: 07 Oct 2006
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Location: Phoenix, Arizona

PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 11:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lou Jost wrote:
You should experiment!


Grin ... I would love to but as usual (on this forum) I am way out of my league but sounds very interesting. If it wasn't for a couple of people going out of their way, on a daily basis for 'months' helping me off-line in microscopy I would still be on first base and would have probably gave up.

Looking forward to seeing your setup and results.

-JW:
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ray_parkhurst



Joined: 20 Nov 2010
Posts: 1076
Location: Santa Clara, CA, USA

PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 6:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mawyatt wrote:
Lou,

With todays technology a single sodium atom can cause a chip to malfunction!

A new fab can cost upwards of $15B and the chip processing machines cost many 100s of millions each. It takes a bunch of these machines to create a line to fabricate chips!

We are routinely dealing with 14nm now, soon 10nm and 7nm is in development.

Chip development cost can be as high as $100M and are continually rising. Intel spends way more than this on their processor development I've been told.

However this technology isn't decades away, or years away. It's in your iPhone and iPad now, and it's affordable to the average person!!!

Amazing indeed!!

And yes those lenses are incredible!!

Best,

Mike


TSMC just announced it's building a 3nm fab in Tainan Science Park to be operational in 2020.

I can't even imagine a 3nm transistor. My company is still working on 8" with legacy machines at 180nm.
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Lou Jost



Joined: 04 Sep 2015
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Location: Ecuador

PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 6:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ray, do you know much about some of these legacy lenses? Or is there a source to ask?
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ray_parkhurst



Joined: 20 Nov 2010
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Location: Santa Clara, CA, USA

PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 7:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lou...I know a little about them, but you can find a decent amount of info on the web searching for photolithographic steppers. Of course today they are scanners and use lasers instead of arc lamps. Most of what's available used is scavenged from older steppers and are designed for use with various emission line spectra.
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Lou Jost



Joined: 04 Sep 2015
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ray, there is almost nothing online about particular lenses, though there are lots of general articles and even books on the subject. Luckily the Zeiss lenses are well-labeled, usually with m, NA, and optimal wavelength. But GCA/Tropel lenses usually only have model numbers and serial numbers.
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mawyatt



Joined: 22 Aug 2013
Posts: 985

PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ray_parkhurst wrote:
mawyatt wrote:
Lou,

With todays technology a single sodium atom can cause a chip to malfunction!

A new fab can cost upwards of $15B and the chip processing machines cost many 100s of millions each. It takes a bunch of these machines to create a line to fabricate chips!

We are routinely dealing with 14nm now, soon 10nm and 7nm is in development.

Chip development cost can be as high as $100M and are continually rising. Intel spends way more than this on their processor development I've been told.

However this technology isn't decades away, or years away. It's in your iPhone and iPad now, and it's affordable to the average person!!!

Amazing indeed!!

And yes those lenses are incredible!!

Best,

Mike


TSMC just announced it's building a 3nm fab in Tainan Science Park to be operational in 2020.

I can't even imagine a 3nm transistor. My company is still working on 8" with legacy machines at 180nm.


Pretty amazing, that fab must cost well upwards of $15B!!

On 8" I think you are limited to 90nm, at least that's the smallest available to us @ 8" (GF 9HP).

At 3nm you could probably put ten 486 processors under a single 100 microns square bond pad!! Crazy device density!!
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