Focusing rail: What do you use?

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yeatzee
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Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2011 3:13 am

Post by yeatzee »

mark_h wrote:I have both and find the x-y table is too large to sit on the top a of a tripod, it is great for a bench set up.
I got a newport 430 linear stage on e-bay for 150.00 and it is the best I have found for a field set-up. Image
Image
[/img]

How do you attach camera/tripod?

mark_h
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Location: southwestern Ontario Canada
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Post by mark_h »

I have a Manfrotto 488RC2 head but I didn't like the head so I changes it for a Hejnar Arca clamp $60.00 http://cgi.ebay.com/3-25-clamp-RRS-Mark ... 4cf68401d2 I think it is more secure and when used with a long Arca rail the complete rig can be slide for and aft for course focusing.
Image

I mounted an 8" Hejnar rail $40.00 http://cgi.ebay.com/8-0-rail-scale-Arca ... 35b1094ba9 to the bottom of the newport stage using the holes in the stage. A second Arca clamp is mounted on top of the stage and the camera is mounted with another Arca rail
Image

I have found the whole set-up very stable and versitile
Good luck

yeatzee
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Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2011 3:13 am

Post by yeatzee »

Ok I need to ponder everything posted a bit more before I respond directly. Until than, here's what caused the thread:

Image
Test "handheld" stack by yeatzee (now 17, but still learning), on Flickr

My attempt at handheld stacking of a dead insect to get a lot of detail. It was only a test to see what was possible and sure enough I realized I need/want a reliable stacking system that doesn't require insane concentration and precision :wink: (also some objectives as im just not getting that sharpness I crave!)

The image is all jacked up, not nearly enough of it in focus and there was a small sliver of the eye that never got 100% in focus so I quickly covered it up with the clone tool for viewing here. I did my best and was extremely exhuasted after putting myself through that (not to mention it was at night! Trying to make out points of focus in a pitch black viewfinder and than getting blinded every time the flashes went off :shock: ) It was a learning experience and now I REALLY want to attempt some of those insane 100+ stacked images you guys post. The linear stage like the newport seems to be my best option along with a bellows of some sort (cheap ebay one since first party is way to expensive or M42?). I don't quite understand what else I need to connect the camera/bellows to the stage and tripod to the stage properly (easy = better ;) ) though. Im sorry, I know its like talking to a 7 year old kid in regards to this kind of stuff but I am truly clueless about everything tripodish (something not a lens or camera or flash :wink: )

yeatzee
Posts: 292
Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2011 3:13 am

Post by yeatzee »

mark_h wrote:I have a Manfrotto 488RC2 head but I didn't like the head so I changes it for a Hejnar Arca clamp $60.00 http://cgi.ebay.com/3-25-clamp-RRS-Mark ... 4cf68401d2 I think it is more secure and when used with a long Arca rail the complete rig can be slide for and aft for course focusing.
http://www.photomacrography.net/forum/u ... ipod_1.jpg

I mounted an 8" Hejnar rail $40.00 http://cgi.ebay.com/8-0-rail-scale-Arca ... 35b1094ba9 to the bottom of the newport stage using the holes in the stage. A second Arca clamp is mounted on top of the stage and the camera is mounted with another Arca rail
http://www.photomacrography.net/forum/u ... late_1.jpg

I have found the whole set-up very stable and versitile
Good luck
So you are using 2 arca clamps and 2 arca rails on the setup in addition to the $100+ newport stage? So a grand total of lets say $100 + 2(40) + 2(60) = ~$300? Are the extra parts in addition to the stage necessary or are there significantly cheaper options even if they are of less quality (as I assume a tiny piece of metal costing $60 must be of the utmost quality) ?

Thanks for the help by the way! I appreciate everyone's patience.

Planapo
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Location: Germany, in the United States of Europe

Post by Planapo »

Tanner,

It seems you have decided on a linear stage for your set-up. The ones I use and most of those stages have a lot of threaded holes.

For making use of these holes without expensive clamps and rails, I had my handy male assistant :) manufacture adapter plates from 10 mm thick aluminium sheet material (bought cheaply as offcuts from a local metal dealer, but can be found on ebay too). The aluminium of this thickness can be cut with an electronic jig saw. With some thought, appropriate holes drilled through the aluminium plates and some bolts and nuts you can make the adapters you need. Provides a very stable, wobble-free connection. With ordinary bolts this gives me no quick release, of course. But as I use bellows, the camera can be taken off easily anyway.

--Betty

ChrisR
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Post by ChrisR »

Tan
Yep, the cost of the boring parts soon adds up.
One thing you'll notice with some of the Newport stages is that they say they're Imperial, or English threads. That (always I think) means there's a 1/4 x 20tpi threaded hole in them. That of course is the standard tripod screw. :smt050 Though it might be on what you would have thought was the "top", that doesn't matter much, you can fix the thing upside down on a tripod head.

On what was the "bottom" you'll have all sorts of holes.
So you need to screw a plate of some sort down onto that, to fix your camera or bellows to.
A "nice" option is one of those Arca type clamps and a longish rail for the camera. It would be good and solid but there are cheaper options, such as a cheapo slide rail like
this
or an X - Y one like this

One other variant of the Newport rail you'll see is where the micrometer comes out of the middle at the back. They aren't quite a s convenient, but you'll manage, and they're often cheaper.
Some are 1", some 2" micrometers. Your actual stack may well be under an inch, but the extra throw makes setting-up easier.

To fix the base of the "slider" to the top of the "newport" you're just gonna have to drill some holes and find the right screws. Easy with a small pillar drill. Maybe you need to groom some avuncular geezer who plays with radio controlled planes or somesuch :D .

yeatzee
Posts: 292
Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2011 3:13 am

Post by yeatzee »

ChrisR wrote:Tan
Yep, the cost of the boring parts soon adds up.
One thing you'll notice with some of the Newport stages is that they say they're Imperial, or English threads. That (always I think) means there's a 1/4 x 20tpi threaded hole in them. That of course is the standard tripod screw. :smt050 Though it might be on what you would have thought was the "top", that doesn't matter much, you can fix the thing upside down on a tripod head.

On what was the "bottom" you'll have all sorts of holes.
So you need to screw a plate of some sort down onto that, to fix your camera or bellows to.
A "nice" option is one of those Arca type clamps and a longish rail for the camera. It would be good and solid but there are cheaper options, such as a cheapo slide rail like
this
or an X - Y one like this

One other variant of the Newport rail you'll see is where the micrometer comes out of the middle at the back. They aren't quite a s convenient, but you'll manage, and they're often cheaper.
Some are 1", some 2" micrometers. Your actual stack may well be under an inch, but the extra throw makes setting-up easier.

To fix the base of the "slider" to the top of the "newport" you're just gonna have to drill some holes and find the right screws. Easy with a small pillar drill. Maybe you need to groom some avuncular geezer who plays with radio controlled planes or somesuch :D .
Ok I think what i need to do is just get a linear stage already, get it to my house, and just go from there. This is all very difficult without being able to see it in person. Now last time I looked on ebay there were plenty of those 430 newport linear stages with 2 inch micrometers. Now that I look there appears to be none.

So here are some possible options I need to know your feedback on:

Newport 420 linear stage with 1 inch micrometer - http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 500wt_1156

the seller says: "I had to replace the factory actuator dovetail clamp screws with screws and nuts."
Your thoughts on this?

----------------------------------------------------

Newport 430 linear stage - http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 500wt_1156

The seller says: "I had to replace the actuator dovetail clamp screw with a screw and nut. Unit has a metric actuator with 25mm travel."
Your thoughts?

-----------------------------------------------------------

On another note, what about getting a linear stage without the micrometer, than buying this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 500wt_1156

Can this be attached to a linear stage? If so, how easy would it be (do I need tools?).

ChrisR
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Post by ChrisR »

Not sure what he means about using screws and nuts.
Seem cheap enough though.
But 2" would be a little easier in siome curcumstances.

You could use something like this
http://cgi.ebay.com/Lufkin-513-Depth-Mi ... 27ba5378d1
to shove part of a bellows unit along. Thought of it but never did it.

Those stages say nothing about what the threads are. :evil:

Planapo
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Location: Germany, in the United States of Europe

Post by Planapo »

Those stages say nothing about what the threads are. :evil:


Today Newport designate their stages with metric threads by a leading letter M in the model or series number. So my "426"s have the odd inch threads whereas the (otherwise identical) stage with metric threads is designated "M-426". So a one just labelled "Model 430" should likely have the inch threads.

--Betty

yeatzee
Posts: 292
Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2011 3:13 am

Post by yeatzee »

ChrisR wrote:Not sure what he means about using screws and nuts.
Seem cheap enough though.
But 2" would be a little easier in siome curcumstances.

You could use something like this
http://cgi.ebay.com/Lufkin-513-Depth-Mi ... 27ba5378d1
to shove part of a bellows unit along. Thought of it but never did it.

Those stages say nothing about what the threads are. :evil:
Is it the micrometer that gives the 2 inch capability? So any newport 4xx stage has the potential for that? How is it attached to the stage?

Id rather just stick with the stage idea since I know the most about it which isn't much but I still feel fairly comfortable with it.

Should I just wait for a decent 430 series with 2" micrometer on ebay and go from there?

ChrisLilley
Posts: 674
Joined: Sat May 01, 2010 6:12 am
Location: Nice, France (I'm British)

Post by ChrisLilley »

yeatzee wrote:
On another note, what about getting a linear stage without the micrometer, than buying this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 500wt_1156

Can this be attached to a linear stage? If so, how easy would it be (do I need tools?).
You only need part of that, though. Suggest you search for "micrometer head" rather than just "micrometer".

ChrisLilley
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Joined: Sat May 01, 2010 6:12 am
Location: Nice, France (I'm British)

Post by ChrisLilley »

yeatzee wrote: Is it the micrometer that gives the 2 inch capability?
No. Some stages have more travel than others. So you need a stage that can move two inches, plus a micrometer head that can move two inches (and has the right size mounting to fit your stage).
yeatzee wrote:How is it attached to the stage?
There is a clamp, which tightens and loosens with a small allen (hex) nut.
yeatzee wrote:Should I just wait for a decent 430 series with 2" micrometer on ebay and go from there?
That has the advantage that you know the micrometer head is the right size to fit, and has the right travel.

Planapo
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Location: Germany, in the United States of Europe

Post by Planapo »

Should I just wait for a decent 430 series with 2" micrometer on ebay and go from there?
I've found that 25 mm (~ 1 inch) travel is far enough for fine stacking with such a stage. I haven't used more than 15 mm or so, and can't think that I'll ever need the full inch travel for stacking with such a stage.
This may enlarge your "range of prey" while trawling the 'Bay.

--Betty

mark_h
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Location: southwestern Ontario Canada
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Post by mark_h »

2 inch travel http://www.lightglassoptics.com/Newport ... p_113.html#
I don't know anything about the company but this is the stage I have

yeatzee
Posts: 292
Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2011 3:13 am

Post by yeatzee »

Ok so im going to be buying a newport stage tomorrow + a cheap macro rail as suggested. My question is though, how exactly can I attach the focusing rail with camera attached to the stage and how can I attach the stage to the tripod on the other end?

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