Testing two similar digital cameraphones, 2 pics

Cyclops · Post by **Cyclops** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 9:07 am

I have 2 similar cameraphones that i use to take pics thru my microscope, both Sony Ericsson, both have 2MP cameras.
One is a W800i,which has a great camera but is old now and half the buttons dont work so i use it only for the camera.
The other is the 'upgrade' that I got, itself now looking worse for wear but I can browse the net with it better.

Now altho the camera on the newer 850i is 2MP it does not focus, it is a fixed focus unit, which in theory is better for microscope work because it means the camera wont try and focus itself before the shutter is fired potentially ruining the shot.
BUT, and its a big but, the resolutionn on the 850i leaves a lot to be desired. Why oh why couldnt they have put the same camera with firmware into the upgrapde I'll never know but it is next to uselss in general use, plus you cant zoom in when in 2 or 1MP mode,only in vga mode, and you really dont want to zoom with that!

Anyway onto the pics. I chose as an example some pins in a holder using ambient lighting, the scope set up with 4x objective and 10x ocular.
Also i didnt zoom in like i normally do(cant anyway with the 850!) so the images appear as a circle (both are cropped anyway just up to the circle border, beforehand they are just a large image dot in a sea of black)

Pic 1, the W800i

pic 2, the W850i

you can see I think in the second one a definite softness, and lack of detail, especially in the dark curve on the background( a hair?) left side of the image, which almost disappears in the second image.

Hmm, I think I should have tried this with some printed text instead.

Danny · Post by **Danny** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 2:12 pm

Interesting. Good results as well.

The top shot looks sharper but I think thats a result of over sharpening. Seems to be more noise in that first shot and that results in what might seem to be sharper. That could be in the algorithm used in the camera / phone...........maybe. It might be what you used, software wise.

The second shot has more CA present. I actually prefer the second shot for the main area. Seem to be more you could probably do with that.........in my opinion anyway.

All the best and very interesting exercise. I like it.

Danny.

Cyclops · Post by **Cyclops** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 2:20 pm

nzmacro wrote:Interesting. Good results as well.

The top shot looks sharper but I think thats a result of over sharpening. Seems to be more noise in that first shot and that results in what might seem to be sharper. That could be in the algorithm used in the camera / phone...........maybe. It might be what you used, software wise.

The second shot has more CA present. I actually prefer the second shot for the main area. Seem to be more you could probably do with that.........in my opinion anyway.

All the best and very interesting exercise. I like it.

Danny.

Thanks Danny. These are straight out of the camera as it were, no sharpening or brightness/contrast altered,just as is.

rjlittlefield · Post by **rjlittlefield** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 2:46 pm

How about posting out a resized version of the full frame, so that we can see what "large image dot in a sea of black" really means?

--Rik

Danny · Post by **Danny** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 3:18 pm

Better explain what I mean

. For me personally and what I use software wise, I would rather start off with a slightly softer image than an over sharpened one. That might not suit most people and probably just a me "thing"

Are these taken with the camera phone on full zoom, or do they even have a zoom. I'm guessing they do. With the FZ10, I use the zoom as much as possible to avoid the vignetting effect.

All the best and amazing how far we have come with these phone cameras.

Danny.

Cyclops · Post by **Cyclops** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 3:42 pm

rjlittlefield wrote:How about posting out a resized version of the full frame, so that we can see what "large image dot in a sea of black" really means?

--Rik

Yep,can do. This is how it looks on the phone screen. I usually zoom in to get more of the image which alters the magnification,but this is straight,no zoom

rjlittlefield · Post by **rjlittlefield** » Mon Mar 03, 2008 10:22 pm

Thanks, this image makes much more clear what's going on.

I had thought that perhaps you meant a dot of 1/2 the frame height or less, in which case I was having a lot of trouble understanding what's going on.

But what I see here is consistent with a wide angle camera looking through an ordinary eyepiece.

I just tested a brand new Sony Ericsson W580i (yes, "W580i") with my two scopes. On one of them, the circle just fills the height of the camera frame, and on the other, the circle is cut off some on top and bottom, but still does not quite fill the frame side-to-side.

The W580i is advertised as having a 2.0 MP camera. Its "2 MP" "fine quality" images are indeed 1600 x 1200 pixels, but the quality is not good when viewed at actual pixels and compared with what comes out of either of my Canon point-and-shoots. The sample in front of me right now was shot in full daylight of some houses and trees across the street. It is simultaneously blocky, blotchy, and pixellated, and it has colored Moire patterns in what should be finely patterned gray shadows. It's safe to say that I won't be using this phone for any serious photography.

You might find it an interesting experiment to shoot something similar and compare with what you get through the microscope. That could help narrow down whether your problems really have to do with the scope, or are just intrinsic to the phone's camera.

BTW, the W580i also has no zoom except in VGA mode. I think this means there really is no optical zoom at all, just digital resizing.

--Rik

Cyclops · Post by **Cyclops** » Tue Mar 04, 2008 3:04 am

Rik that sounds like camera in my sony ericsson W850i, rubbish camera that doesn't focus(second pic of mine)
Does the camera in your W580i focus at all or is it fixed too? Now the camera on the previous W800i is a totally different camera. It delivers true digital quality and you can hear it focus,plus you can zoom in to 2.5x. Great camera,that can give 6x4 prints.

rjlittlefield · Post by **rjlittlefield** » Tue Mar 04, 2008 7:54 am

"Does the camera in your W580i focus at all or is it fixed too?"

Fixed. The USB interface does not work reliably, either.

--Rik

Cyclops · Post by **Cyclops** » Tue Mar 04, 2008 7:59 am

rjlittlefield wrote:"Does the camera in your W580i focus at all or is it fixed too?"

Fixed. The USB interface does not work reliably, either.

--Rik

Yea as i thought. It seems they only put the good cameras in their Cybershot phones nowadays.(K800i is a very good one with 3.2 MP)