Simple setup with bridge camera.

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skrylten
Posts: 60
Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2014 1:41 pm

Simple setup with bridge camera.

Post by skrylten »

Santa was nice to me and gave me a Powershot SX50 at Christmas.
I have tested it with Raynox DCR250 and MSN202 and want to share the result and maybe get some feedback regarding improvements.

Setup:
Canon Powershot SX50
CHDK software in camera
Home made focus bracketing script
Home made diffuser
ZS PMax for stacking

NO rail, tripod or external flash needed ...

Image

Facts with the DCR250:
- Working distance: 110-125 mm
- Object filling frame: 5,5-77 mm
- Possible DOF: 10-110 mm

Facts with the MSN202:
- Working distance: 30-35 mm
- Object filling frame: 2-18 mm
- Possible DOF: 1,5-7 mm

Some stacks (no pre/post-processing or retouching):

DCR250 : Stack with 12 images

Image

DCR250 at max zoom (50x) : Stack with 27 images

Image

MSN202 : Stack with 53 images

Image

MSN202 headshot (needed to stack two stacks to get sufficient DOF): Stack with 59+37 images

Image

MSN202 at max zoom (50x) : Stack with 43 images

Image


Conclusions:
- I need better light with MSN202 due to the short working distance.
- Very soft at full zoom. Diffraction ?

Any improvements I can do without complicating the set up ?

BR

Leif

ChrisR
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Post by ChrisR »

Did you find you got inverse/reversed perspective when you did that? I tried CHDK on a few small-sensor cameras and found it very noticeable with some combinations. ( Objects further away appearing bigger).

skrylten
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Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2014 1:41 pm

Post by skrylten »

@ChrisR

Yes it looks like it zoom more when focus is more distant.
Here are two images. Both with MSN202 at full zoom.
First one at closest possible focus and the second focused at infinity.

Image
Image

skrylten
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Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2014 1:41 pm

Post by skrylten »

It also seems like I can get a better result by zooming out and use the built-in "2x digital converter".

Less zoom => wider aperture and less diffraction ?

Image

rjlittlefield
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Re: Simple setup with bridge camera.

Post by rjlittlefield »

Any improvements I can do without complicating the set up ?
Aside from better color balance, I don't know how to make big improvements on this without making some major changes in the setup.

Your MSN-202 is 40 mm and optimized to be used in the way you're using it, so by specification it's about equal to a 5X infinity-design microscope objective. Swapping in a real 4-5X microscope objective might get you some better sharpness and contrast for smaller subjects, but I can't guarantee that.

The next step up would be to use a 10X objective paired with lower optical zoom on your camera, but vignetting is always a concern there. To investigate that possibility at zero cost, you might play around with putting a mask with a 10 mm hole about 10 mm in front of your lens, mimicking the hole in the back of an objective.

The big thing that strikes my attention is that there's a lot of opportunity for improvement in post-processing. I think if you ran that last image in your first post through a strong sharpening filter, you'd be pretty surprised about how much detail that's currently hidden can be made visible.
- Very soft at full zoom. Diffraction ?
Probably not. Diffraction is established by the effective aperture, which in your setup is established entirely by the setting of the camera lens. If the image you're getting through the MSN-202 is significantly less sharp than what you get looking across the street through an open window with the same lens settings, then diffraction is not the cause.

Also, diffraction mainly eats away at fine detail, leaving overall contrast unchanged. What I'm seeing here looks like it's due to other aberrations.

I suggest running a test series at various aperture settings to see what gives the best result.

--Rik

Edit: I see that while I've been typing you posted a followup done with different settings. My earlier suggestions and comments still apply, however.

johan
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Post by johan »

Agree with Rik, it has more information that can be squeezed out. Skrylten, I hope you don't mind me fiddling with it - 10 minutes with Topaz Detail 3 did quite a nice job with this:

Image
My extreme-macro.co.uk site, a learning site. Your comments and input there would be gratefully appreciated.

skrylten
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Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2014 1:41 pm

Post by skrylten »

Rik&Johan

Thanks for your input.
I will test on, both with camera settings and post-processing ...

skrylten
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Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2014 1:41 pm

Post by skrylten »

Had to give butterfly scales a try ...
Full optical zoom with MSN-202.Image

skrylten
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Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2014 1:41 pm

Post by skrylten »

and a crop 600x450 pixels
Image

fonakta
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Location: Hungary

Post by fonakta »

Hi, i am working with similar gear, Fuji HS30 + Raynox DCR 250, MSN 505.
I tried a homemade aperture in the MSN 505's back end. It's a single ring from black cartoon paper. Aperture is 20 mm. With this aperture the image is sharper and has less chromatic aberration.

skrylten
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Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2014 1:41 pm

Post by skrylten »

Thanks for that idea fonakta. Works well with my set up as well.

"Normal stack"
Image

Stack with a 14,5 mm "aperture" in the back of MSN 202.
Image

moorli
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Post by moorli »

Thanks for posting your setup Leif. I just got an SX50 and I'm hoping to get some shots like yours.
Last edited by moorli on Fri Dec 01, 2023 8:57 am, edited 4 times in total.

Manuelm
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Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2018 1:06 am

Post by Manuelm »

skrylten wrote:Thanks for that idea fonakta. Works well with my set up as well.

"Normal stack"
Image

Stack with a 14,5 mm "aperture" in the back of MSN 202.
Image
Butterfly scales are amazing! There is a Youtube channel called Smarter Every Day with a photography series about this topic, though he uses a microscope to capture pictures that blow my mind: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zsjyWg-Lhek. This one really inspired me to try and capture butterfly wings. It's a great subject :)
moorli wrote:
fonaktea wrote:Hi, i am working with similar gear, Fuji HS30 + Raynox DCR 250, MSN 505.
I tried a homemade aperture in the MSN 505's back end. It's a single ring from black cartoon paper. Aperture is 20 mm. With this aperture the yoga burn images is sharper and has less chromatic aberration.
Thanks for posting your setup Leif. I just got an SX50 and I'm hoping to get some shots like yours.
Yeah, I also have an SX50, I'm sure you're having a great time with that one.

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